Request for variant subtag fr 16th-c 17th-c Resubmitted!

CE Whitehead cewcathar at hotmail.com
Fri Dec 15 23:03:03 CET 2006


One more time; below are two alternative proposals for the two subtags;  my 
preferred proposal is the second one, the original one but modified to 
16siecle and 17siecle); the top one is the one some members of this list 
prefer!
But it really contains two options, either the tags can still be 16siecle 
(or else 1606nict which I do not like, what is that?) and 17siecle (or else 
1694acad which is better than 1606nict but I prefer to still leave it 
17siecle).  But it is referenced to the specific dictionaries.
Thanks.


--C. E. Whitehead
cewcathar at hotmail.com

ALTERNATIVE ONE (has two alternatives really and some of you might prefer 
1606 and 1694 too)

LANGUAGE SUBTAG REGISTRATION FORM
1. Name of requester:  C. E. Whitehead
2. E-mail address of requester: cewcathar at hotmail.com
3. Record Requested:

Type: Variant
Subtag:  1606Nict or alternately 16siecle
Description: French as spoken in Jean Nicot, "Thresor de la langue 
francoyse" 1606; ARTFL Project, University of Chicago:
http://portail.atilf.fr/dictionnaires/TLF-NICOT/index.htm
which includes much of the 16th century French (the last century of Middle 
French)
Prefix: fr, frm
Preferred-Value:
Deprecated:
Suppress-Script:
Comments:

4. Intended meaning of the subtag:
5. Reference to published description
of the language (book or article):

* Joachim du Bellay, La deffence et illustration de la langue francoyse, 
1549; ed critique by Henri Chamard, Geneve, Slatkine Rpt. 1969

* Jean Nicot, "Thresor de la langue francoyse" 1606; ARTFL Project, 
University of Chicago:
http://portail.atilf.fr/dictionnaires/TLF-NICOT/index.htm

6. Any other relevant information:
See alternate request below!



LANGUAGE SUBTAG REGISTRATION FORM
1. Name of requester:  C. E. Whitehead
2. E-mail address of requester: cewcathar at hotmail.com
3. Record Requested:

Type: Variant
Subtag:  1694acad (or 17siecle)
Description: roughly,  French as catalogued in the "Dictionnaire de 
l'académe françoise", 4eme ed. 1694; which is 17th century French, or early 
Modern French, sometimes with elements of Middle French
Prefix: fr, frm
Preferred-Value:
Deprecated:
Suppress-Script:
Comments: combining elements of Middle and Modern French with some New World 
vocabulary and not completely stable

4. Intended meaning of the subtag:
5. Reference to published description
of the language (book or article):
* Dictionnaire de l'académe françoise, 4eme ed. 1694; RTFL Project, 
University of Chicago:
http://portail.atilf.fr/dictionnaires/ACADEMIE/index.htm

* Fénelon, François de Salignac de La Mothe (1984), Fenelon's Letter to the 
French Academy : with an introduction and commentary.

* Ayres-Bennett, Wendy (2004), Sociolinguistic variation in 
seventeenth-century France : methodology and case studies.

also:
http://teacherweb.com/FL/Cocoa/CEWhitehead/HTMLPage15.stm


6. Any other relevant information:  See below

ALTERNATIVE TWO


LANGUAGE SUBTAG REGISTRATION FORM
1. Name of requester:  C. E. Whitehead
2. E-mail address of requester: cewcathar at hotmail.com
3. Record Requested:

Type: Variant
Subtag:  16siecle
Description: 16th century French (which is the last century of Middle 
French)
Prefix: fr, frm
Preferred-Value:
Deprecated:
Suppress-Script:
Comments:

4. Intended meaning of the subtag:
5. Reference to published description
of the language (book or article):

* Joachim du Bellay, La deffence et illustration de la langue francoyse, 
1549; ed critique by Henri Chamard, Geneve, Slatkine Rpt. 1969

* Jean Nicot, "Thresor de la langue francoyse" 1606; ARTFL Project, 
University of Chicago:
http://portail.atilf.fr/dictionnaires/TLF-NICOT/index.htm

6. Any other relevant information:
Also you might see the information about this century in:  Catholic Central 
French,  "The History of the French Language," Detroit Catholic Central 
High: http://www.catholiccentral.net/academics/french/history.html
this is when French became the language of France; the period just before 
was that of the 100 years' war between France and England with some 
borrowing of vocabulary back and forth; it's essentially the same French as 
spoken in the 16th century, just not spoken so widely, but there is a bit of 
spelling variation when compared with the 16th century French.  (Here is an 
example of 15th century French writing by Villon apparently mostly edited 
into modern French:  http://francite.net/education//page89.html; see a more 
original version of Villon's language at:  
http://www.languefrancaise.net/dossiers/dossiers.php?id_dossier=74#b2)



LANGUAGE SUBTAG REGISTRATION FORM
1. Name of requester:  C. E. Whitehead
2. E-mail address of requester: cewcathar at hotmail.com
3. Record Requested:

Type: Variant
Subtag:  17siecle
Description: 17th century French, or early Modern French, sometimes with 
elements of Middle French
Prefix: fr, frm
Preferred-Value:
Deprecated:
Suppress-Script:
Comments: combining elements of Middle and Modern French with some New World 
vocabulary and not completely stable

4. Intended meaning of the subtag:
5. Reference to published description
of the language (book or article):
* Dictionnaire de l'académe françoise, 4eme ed. 1694; RTFL Project, 
University of Chicago:
http://portail.atilf.fr/dictionnaires/ACADEMIE/index.htm

* Fénelon, François de Salignac de La Mothe (1984), Fenelon's Letter to the 
French Academy : with an introduction and commentary.

* Ayres-Bennett, Wendy (2004), Sociolinguistic variation in 
seventeenth-century France : methodology and case studies.

also:
http://teacherweb.com/FL/Cocoa/CEWhitehead/HTMLPage15.stm


6. Any other relevant information:

for the reference,
http://portail.atilf.fr/cgi-bin/getobject_?p.0:45./var/artfla/dicos/ACAD_1694/IMAGE/ 
[in Le dictionnaire de l'académe françoise, 1694;

note the Academe Fracoise was established in 1635 but the 1694 dictionary 
shows that French in this century had not been completely standardized.

for the reference,
http://teacherweb.com/FL/Cocoa/CEWhitehead/HTMLPage15.stm

notes from description of late 17th century U.S. French:

Grammar Changes

Singular nouns in the nominative may end in "s" as may their adjectives (in 
the middle ages, in Old French, the nominative endings for the plural and 
singular were the reverse of today's endings; the oblique endings for the 
plural and singular are what today's endings, with -s for the plural, are 
based on):

un/uns? isles
  (Fr. Moderne: un île)
semblables
  (Fr. Moderne: semblable)

Spelling/Misspelling
trouver
  'to find,' might be spelled trouve, 'found' ; trouvez, 'you find'; or 
'trouver' 'to find' (trouver and trouve with the accent on the e are 
pronounced identically; that may be why)
note that the common spelling of the past participle, trouve (with the 
accent aigu on the e) at this time was 'trouvez'

Spelling Changes
ai becomes, sometimes oi; ait becomes sometimes oist; êt (and also et and 
ét) becomes sometimes est; ot becomes sometimes ost; îl becomes sometimes 
isl; ui becomes, sometimes uy; and oin becomes oing. Occasionally, v may be 
realized as b, while both s and c may be realized as sc as in "scavoir" (for 
"savoir') and "escrasent" (for 'écrasent'); also dipthongs with i may be 
spelled with y as in "celuy" (for 'celui').
Additionally, ocasionally archaic nominative forms ending in "s" (from Old 
French) might be used!

alesne
(Fr. Moderne "alène," 'awl;' see 
http://portail.atilf.fr/cgi-bin/getobject_?p.0:45./var/artfla/dicos/ACAD_1694/IMAGE/ 
[in Le dictionnaire de l'académe françoise, 1694; this reference was 
supplied by Gardefeu at http://www.wordreference.com])
allast
  (Fr. Moderne "allât," 'go,' imparfait du subjonctif/imperfect of the 
subjunctive.)
avoit, alternately aboit
  (Fr. Moderne "avait," 'he, she, it had')
avoient
  (Fr. Moderne avaient, 'they had')
cassetestes
  (Fr. Moderne "casse-têtes" 'war clubs,' perhaps 'tomahawks')
celuy
  (Fr. Moderne "celui" 'that one,' 'which one')
charioit
  (Fr. Moderne "chariait"?)
connoistre
  (Fr. Moderne "connaitre," 'to be acquainted with')
costé
  (Fr. Moderne "côté'," 'coast,' 'side')
disoit
  (Fr. Moderne "disait," 'he, she, it said,' 'he, she, it was saying')
escrasent
  (Fr. Moderne "écrasent," 'they crush' or 'mash')
escrit
  (Fr. Moderne "écrit," past participle of "écrire," 'write')
esté
  (Fr. Moderne "été," past participle of "être," 'been')
estoit, étoit
  (Fr. Moderne "était," 'he, she, it was')
estoient, étoient
  (Fr. Moderne "étaient," 'they were')
fasoit
  (Fr. Moderne "faisait," 'he, she, it was doing')
fenestres
  (Fr. Moderne "fenêtres," 'windows')
feste
  (Fr. Moderne "fête," 'feast,' 'celebration')
francois
  (Fr. Moderne "Français")
froterisont
  (probably Fr. Moderne "fraternisèrent," the simple past tense of 
"fraterniser," to 'fraternize;' in addition to subsituting an 'o' for the 
'a' in "fraterniser," de la Salle le jeune seems to have invented some of 
the word's spelling.)
iroit
  (Fr. Moderne "irait," 'would go' [conditional of "aller," 'go')
isles
  (Fr. Moderne "île," 'island;' the -s ending on "isle" is from the Old 
French nominative form)
loing
  (Fr. Moderne "loin," 'far')
luy
  (Fr. Moderne "lui", 'him,' 'it')
nommoient
  (Fr. Moderne "nommaient," 'they were named')
paroist
  (Fr. Moderne "parait," imperfect of "paraitre," 'it seemed')
pluye
  (Fr. Moderne "pluie," 'rain')
peschoient
  (Fr. Moderne "peschaient," 'they fished,' 'they were fishing')
pourroit
  (Fr. Moderne "pourrait," 'he, she, it could') [I misspelled!]
scavoir
  (Fr. Moderne "savoir," 'to know')
sçavoit
  (Fr. Moderne "savait," 'he, she, it knew,''he, she, it could tell')
sise
  (Archaic French [feminine? not in this case] form of Fr. Moderne "six," 
'six')
soi
  (Fr. Moderne "soi," 'self;' or "soi-même," 'oneself')
tirois or tiroit
  (Fr. Moderne "tirait," 'drew' as in drew a bow--to shoot an arrow)

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