ADs who are also WG chairs

[James Seng]

Hallam-Baker, Phillip wrote:
> I am saying the charge is utterly irrelevant to the argument. It is 
> simply a convenient excuse not to consider the unpleasant ugly little
> fact that the very system that you are claiming is impossible is
> working fine in OASIS.

It is absolutely relevant. If you can find an organisation which is not 
restrictive in its membership AND at the same time deal with consensus 
using voting mechanism, then let us know.

> I am certainly NOT 'assuming' that democracy would work for the IETF,
> I am demonstrating that it works in a body that does very similar
> work and further that the cosmetic differences between the 
> organizations do not affect the workability of democracy. That
> is not 'assuming', it is a reasoned argument. You on the other hand
> are asserting that democracy cannot work in the IETF on the basis of 
> no proof whatsoever.

Yes, OASIS works within its context. But it is comparing apple & orange. 
One is a paid-membership model and the other isn't.

Proof me wrong. Name me one organisation I asked for as above.

> If you do not want ALL Internet standards developed in that forum
> reform the IETF so that it is genuinely open, democratic and
> accountable.

Once again, 'democratic' is not one of our core principle, AFAIK. 
Running code & rough consensus is the IETF core principle.

Or are you proposing we change this too?

-James Seng