Charters, "normal process" versus ISOC, etc. (was: Re

[John C Klensin]

--On Tuesday, 20 May, 2003 18:33 -0400 Keith Moore 
<moore at cs.utk.edu> wrote:

>> We have a disgruntled community.  We have productivity
>> problems.
>>
>> Some changes are underway, including finally getting better
>> tracking software. All that is fine, but it has literally
>> nothing at all to do with the core problems. The core
>> problems are deep and long-standing. They have to do with
>> transparency, accountability, responsiveness and conflicting
>> responsibilities.
>
> IMHO the core problem is the inability of many working groups
> to produce technically sound output in a timely manner.
> Trying to blame this on IESG is counterproductive.

Keith and Dave,

Neither of you really need to be reminded of this, but the issue 
isn't placing blame (and I didn't read "blame the IESG" into 
Dave's note).  Getting technically sound standards out the door 
in a reasonable amount of time is, under our current procedures 
and working models, a partnership and shared responsibility 
between the IESG, the individual ADs, WG leadership, and WG 
participants.  If we aren't succeeding in the goal of getting 
technically sound documents through the system and out the door 
in a reasonable time, we need to be pursuing _all_ of the 
aspects of our way of doing things that might cure that problem 
-- or we need to adjust our expectations.

Fortunately or unfortunately, it is a good deal easier to think 
about difficulties and ways in which the management and 
oversight structures might be tuned than it is to think about 
finding a mechanism, or the right variety of pixie dust, that 
would cause all WGs to require sufficient wisdom, insight, and 
resources to avoid the need for review and coordination.

We should identify the problems and expectations, fix what we 
can, and figure out how to adjust our expectations to match what 
we cannot fix.  "Blame the IESG" isn't a constructive part of 
the puzzle, IMO, although "blame some things that IESG does or 
some procedures that IESG has" or "blame some ways in which WGs 
are constituted and work" should both, again IMO, be fair game.

      john