Proposal to remove Preferred-Value field for region YU in LTRU

Broome, Karen Karen_Broome at
Mon Mar 2 16:57:19 CET 2009

Two cents: I have a real use case for tagging content with YU today. Motion pictures have a Country of Origin, which may be a country that no longer exists. Country of Origin indicates the country where the producer filed the origin certificate so it should indicate the country that existed at the time the certificate was filed.

I realize that this use case is not related to language, but in this case suggesting CS would not be appropriate. I almost wonder if countries should be considered "deprecated" in the traditional sense. They may no longer be current countries of the world, but that doesn't mean that people aren't going to continue to use these tags in appropriate ways for historical content. If I were to represent our data properly in ISO 3166-1, I need a tag for Bophuthatswana, which existed so briefly, it never had an ISO tag.

I support removing the preferred value.


Karen Broome

From: ietf-languages-bounces at [mailto:ietf-languages-bounces at] On Behalf Of Phillips, Addison
Sent: Saturday, February 28, 2009 8:56 AM
To: CE Whitehead; ietf-languages at
Subject: RE: Proposal to remove Preferred-Value field for region YU in LTRU

It is always possible to add a comment.

As for the issue of countries that separate, there is no reason that I can see to address it further in any draft, past or future, of BCP 47. When new countries are formed, they are always formed from all or part of an old region (even Antarctica has a code). UN M.49 and ISO 3166-1 assign any new regions codes, which we use as subtags. There are quite detailed and clear rules in the current RFC for how this is to be done.

The P-V pointer is mainly useful for regions when a region changes its name (and associated code) but not its borders or “identity”. This *is* what happened when the then Yugoslavia changed its identity, hence the P-V. But since CS is defunct and since YU itself had a “larger” meaning (which is more familiar than the later meaning and is not part of remote history), it seems reasonable to make it revert to its older meaning by removing the P-V. Tag canonicalization will not suffer as a result, which is reasonable.


Addison Phillips
Globalization Architect -- Lab126

Internationalization is not a feature.
It is an architecture.

From: ietf-languages-bounces at [mailto:ietf-languages-bounces at] On Behalf Of CE Whitehead
Sent: Saturday, February 28, 2009 7:36 AM
To: ietf-languages at
Subject: Proposal to remove Preferred-Value field for region YU in LTRU

Hi.  Considering the current rule, which Doug has reminded of, that we need to have a subtag's preferred value point to whatever it points to points to,
instead of forcing readers/implementations to follow a chain, at this point I support removing the preferred-value and adding a comment as soon as it becomes possible to add a comment.
Tex Texin textexin at <mailto:ietf-languages at at DGBP7M81>
Fri Feb 27 21:55:22 CET 2009

> 8) Separate topic- The number of countries in the world seems to grow. This suggests to me that regions being subdivided is not going to be a rare event. Perhaps there should be a mechanism to indicate subtags that have later been split, so instead of one preferred value, there is a way to indicate that a tag has been deprecated in favor of two or more possible values.

However, I do think Tex's point is good here; the issue of countries that separate should be addressed in the next draft of RFC 4646, but I agree we cannot address this at this time.

Hopefully a comment will be sufficient for the interim.

--C. E. Whitehead

cewcathar at<mailto:cewcathar at>

> tex

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