Swiss german, spoken
Karen_Broome at spe.sony.com
Karen_Broome at spe.sony.com
Mon Jun 13 20:48:07 CEST 2005
Sorry if I'm a bit busy today and overwhelmed by the response to my
language request. I now agree with Michael that Swiss German should not be
restricted to a spoken form alone. That distinction was made based on my
use of the language, but likely doesn't apply on a wider basis as this
language is sometimes, if rarely, used in written form. If I need to
resubmit my language request to reflect this change, I'd be happy to do
However, in Debbie's defense, here's why I need the distinctions between
spoken and written languages at Sony Pictures. I realize these are
implementation details, but they may help explain my business need. I am
classifying film product to a list of predefined language categories. I
want these categories to be mutually exclusive. If I'm dubbing a film
into Chinese, I want to see the values:
If I'm subtitling that film, I want my user to see:
Chinese (Mandarin Simplified)
Chinese (Mandarin Traditional)
I do not consider traditional Mandarin to be a "spoken language,"
therefore it cannot be used with dubbed product. If I put three flavors
of Mandarin on my language list, then a user could potentially classify a
dubbed film as traditional or simplified Mandarin, which is bad data.
These classifications must ultimately be passed in standards-compliant XML
(various standards, depending on use).
So for data storage here, I will recommend use of a single language table
associated with proper ISO codes, filtered in a UI via a spoken/written
Boolean I associate with each language. I have analyzed our use of
language here and RFC 3066 met my needs except in the case of Swiss German
and Latin American Spanish, so I applied for those codes. We do not
subtitle into Swiss German, so I had this noted as a spoken variant in my
spreadsheet, but my application for the code shouldn't have made this
Hope this helps explain my request,
"Debbie Garside" <debbie at ictmarketing.co.uk>
Sent by: ietf-languages-bounces at alvestrand.no
06/11/2005 04:19 PM
To: "'Michael Everson'" <everson at evertype.com>, "'IETF Languages Discussion'"
<ietf-languages at iana.org>
Subject: RE: Swiss german, spoken
But for archival and retrieval processes we MAY wish to make a
Remember, there are an awful lot of end users out there using 3066.
Thought of day... Think literally... think laterally... and ye shall have
fuller picture :-)
> -----Original Message-----
> From: ietf-languages-bounces at alvestrand.no [mailto:ietf-languages-
> bounces at alvestrand.no] On Behalf Of Michael Everson
> Sent: 12 June 2005 00:08
> To: 'IETF Languages Discussion'
> Subject: Re: Swiss german, spoken
> At 16:01 -0700 2005-06-11, Randy Presuhn wrote:
> >Hi -
> >> From: "Debbie Garside" <debbie at ictmarketing.co.uk>
> >> To: "'Michael Everson'" <everson at evertype.com>; "'IETF Languages
> >>Discussion'" <ietf-languages at iana.org>
> >> Sent: Saturday, June 11, 2005 3:47 PM
> >> Subject: RE: Swiss german, spoken
> >>IMHO Requests for specifically "Written" tags and "Spoken" tags will
> >> increase in the future and it may be a wise thing to discuss this
> >> rather than later. This is currently catered for within the proposed
> >> if accepted 3066bis (or ter) will (I presume) follow suit.
> >If you would like to ensure that the language tag registry has
> >to specifically support this distinction, please take your concern
> >to the ltru at ietf.org
> >mailing list, preferably with the specific text you'd like to add or
> >The WG is very close to being ready for WG last call on the registry
> >so delay would not be good.
> Oh, I'd really like to say "bollocks" to this notion of "spoken" vs
> "written". A language is a language. EVERY language can be written.
> Representation of dialect forms of written language is not a question
> of written/unwritten.
> Michael Everson * * Everson Typography * * http://www.evertype.com
> Ietf-languages mailing list
> Ietf-languages at alvestrand.no
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