Swiss german, spoken
Addison Phillips
addison.phillips at quest.com
Sat Jun 11 02:28:31 CEST 2005
I'd suggest a glance at the current draft for the proposed replacement, which is known colloquially as RFC 3066bis[1][2]. This explains how "es-419" would become a valid tag (it is actually used as an example in the document) as well as the fate of pre-existing registrations that are no longer necessary because 3066bis defines them (they are redundant, not deprecated).
"gsw" presents more problems. There is a specific prohibition against registering it in RFC 3066... and in 3066bis as well (the space is reserved for ISO 639-2/-3, you see). Certain provisions in 3066bis suggest that a registered tag "gsw" would become redundant under 3066bis when ISO 639-3 gets added to the standard. The problem is the registration of said tag (prohibited, as I said).
Perhaps you should petition ISO 639 RA to make it a 639-2 code? Stranger things have been registered and that would make it valid in any revision of 3066. There are some requirements [3] that might not make such a registration suitable, but that might equally not be the case. Either way, that would address both the prohibition on Michael registering it and the need to wait for ISO 639-3 to finish its work.
Addison
[1] http://www.ietf.org/internet-drafts/draft-ietf-ltru-registry-04.txt
[2] http://www.inter-locale.com/ID/draft-ietf-ltru-registry-04.html
[3] http://www.loc.gov/standards/iso639-2/criteria2.html
Addison P. Phillips
Globalization Architect, Quest Software
Chair, W3C Internationalization Core Working Group
Internationalization is not a feature.
It is an architecture.
> -----Original Message-----
> From: ietf-languages-bounces at alvestrand.no [mailto:ietf-languages-
> bounces at alvestrand.no] On Behalf Of Karen_Broome at spe.sony.com
> Sent: 2005?6?10? 16:41
> To: ietf-languages at iana.org
> Subject: Re: Swiss german, spoken
>
> To be clear, I'm not suggesting that the es-419 code would be deprecated,
> just replaced by the revision of the standard that includes those region
> codes so the unique registration would no longer be necessary.
>
>
>
>
>
> Karen Broome
> 06/10/2005 04:20 PM
>
>
> To: ietf-languages at iana.org
> cc:
> Subject: Re: Swiss german, spoken
>
> I have an immediate need to prepare systems and metadata for eventual
> distribution in the Digital Cinema and MXF formats. (MXF is an XML format
> for film.) We are also working on an ISO audiovisual identification
> standard, ISAN, that obviously requires ISO compliance, yet the ISO
> language standards do not yet meet the descriptive requirements of our
> industry enough to differentiate similar product and language tracks.
>
> We do not like the idea of using non-compliant tagging for work of this
> scope. This work is not Sony-Pictures-specific. It relates to the
> entertainment industry as a whole, where the differences between dialects
> are important and must be encoded in a standards-compliant way. We need
> this metadata to distinguish both dubbing and subtitle tracks.
>
> Latin American Spanish is in wide use today -- it's more common in
> localization than any of the dialects that can be tied to a country region
> -- yet still does not have a proper ISO code. If the 419 code is sure to
> be made available, can it be made compliant today and deprecated when
> replaced by the RFC 3066 revision?
>
> Karen Broome
>
>
>
>
>
> "Mark Davis" <mark.davis at jtcsv.com>
> Sent by: ietf-languages-bounces at alvestrand.no
> 06/10/2005 04:01 PM
>
>
> To: "Peter Constable" <petercon at microsoft.com>, <ietf-
> languages at iana.org>
> cc:
> Subject: Re: Swiss german, spoken
>
>
> Latin American Spanish is in a similar boat. Once 3066bis passes (which is
> looking quite likely these days), then there is a mechanism for doing
> that,
> so ideally we'd wait until then.
>
> Mark
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Peter Constable" <petercon at microsoft.com>
> To: <ietf-languages at iana.org>
> Sent: Friday, June 10, 2005 15:36
> Subject: RE: Swiss german, spoken
>
>
> > From: ietf-languages-bounces at alvestrand.no [mailto:ietf-languages-
> > bounces at alvestrand.no] On Behalf Of Michael Everson
>
>
> > >Tag to be registered : gsw
> >
> > This is not an RFC 3066 tag.
>
> ?!
>
> Of course it's not -- yet. That's why she's asking for it to be
> registered: so it can be one.
>
>
> Technically, there's a problem here in relation to 3066. (Sorry, Karen,
> for not thinking of this before.) An RFC 3066 tag of the form 3alpha
> must be in ISO 639-2. "gsw" is in ISO/DIS 639-3, but not ISO 639-2.
>
> Of course, Karen's problem is that she needs a tag for this now, she'd
> like to use something that conforms to the RFC rather than just using
> something regardless, but she also wants something that conforms with
> what we anticipate will be best practice with a new RFC expected in the
> near future. Thus, her options are:
>
> 1) start using "gsw" anticipating that it will be valid before long
> under a revised RFC (after 639-3 is published), and be non-conformant
> until then
>
> 2) request a tag like i-gsw so she can be conformant now, and then turn
> around in a couple of months and asking for it to be deprecated and
> revise her implementations
>
> 3) request a tag like i-gsw now with the assumption that we'll all be
> saddled long term with this - i.e. one more grandfathered special case
> in 3066bis
>
> 4) request gsw, hoping that people will be willing to bend the rules of
> 3066 by accepting it in anticipation of a future revision
>
>
>
> Both 2 and 3 are undesirable because of the impact with anticipated
> changes in 3066bis. Option 4 isn't permitted by 3066, though I wish that
> wasn't the case. The first option is the only one that's permitted and
> not undesireable for the community overall, though I wish we didn't have
> to leave Karen and MPAA with no better alternative (though it would only
> be temporary).
>
>
>
> Peter Constable
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