I agree. <br><br><div><span class="gmail_quote">On 9/27/06, <b class="gmail_sendername">Debbie Garside</b> <<a href="mailto:debbie@ictmarketing.co.uk">debbie@ictmarketing.co.uk</a>> wrote:</span><blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="border-left: 1px solid rgb(204, 204, 204); margin: 0pt 0pt 0pt 0.8ex; padding-left: 1ex;">
Doug wrote:<br><br>> Another list member wrote:<br>><br>> > Plus comment of See RS for Serbia or ME for Montenegro?<br>><br>> I actually like this idea, and everyone knows how<br>> conservative I am about the Comments field. There will
<br>> probably be people years from now who still think Serbia and<br>> Montenegro are one country (just like the one I talked to six<br>> months ago who thought Czechoslovakia still existed), and<br>> this sort of comment would help them make the right call.
<br><br>I support this idea as it is similar to the comment that was included in GB<br>when GG, IM and JE were added.<br><br>Best regards<br><br>Debbie Garside<br><br><br><br>> -----Original Message-----<br>> From:
<a href="mailto:ietf-languages-bounces@alvestrand.no">ietf-languages-bounces@alvestrand.no</a><br>> [mailto:<a href="mailto:ietf-languages-bounces@alvestrand.no">ietf-languages-bounces@alvestrand.no</a>] On Behalf Of Doug Ewell
<br>> Sent: 27 September 2006 17:35<br>> To: <a href="mailto:ietf-languages@iana.org">ietf-languages@iana.org</a><br>> Subject: Preferred-Value for region CS<br>><br>> I've asked Michael to contact IANA and put a hold on the
<br>> proposal to deprecate region subtag CS without a<br>> Preferred-value, because it has generated some (unfortunately<br>> private) questions.<br>><br>> Stephane Bortzmeyer <bortzmeyer at nic dot fr> wrote:
<br>><br>> >> It should be evident that neither "Serbia" nor "Montenegro" is a<br>> >> suitable replacement for "Serbia and Montenegro."<br>> ><br>> > It is not evident at all. Serbia-and-Montenegro, for
<br>> various reasons<br>> > (location of the capital, military and political strength,<br>> etc) took<br>> > over many of the yugoslav assets such as the top-level domain name<br>> > ".yu" (still alive, since ".cs" was never delegated by ICANN).
<br>> ><br>> > So, giving this habit, and the relative sizes of Serbia and<br>> > Montenegro, it is not evident that CS should not have a<br>> > preferred-value RS. I do not think that ISO 3166 gives any guidance
<br>> > here?<br>><br>> This was analogous to what was done (retroactively) with the<br>> subtag SU for Soviet Union. Russia was the dominant country<br>> out of the 15 Soviet successor states, politically and in
<br>> terms of population, and notably they inherited the Soviet<br>> nuclear weapons arsenal. Despite that, it seemed clear that<br>> for language identification purposes, saying that a language<br>> was "as spoken in the Soviet Union" did not seem equivalent
<br>> to "as spoken in Russia" considering the diversity of the<br>> area and potential for erasing important distinctions.<br>><br>> For example, the tag "ug-SU" for "Uighur as spoken in the
<br>> Soviet Union"<br>> would have been reasonable, to distinguish from "ug-AF" or<br>> "ug-CN". But it would be inappropriate to codify an<br>> assumption that "ug-SU" was equivalent to "ug-RU" through a
<br>> Preferred-Value mapping, because most Uighur in the former<br>> Soviet Union is spoken in Kazakhstan, not in Russia.<br>><br>> On a much smaller and probably less linguistically important<br>> scale, there is a subtag "NT" for "Neutral Zone," a small
<br>> no-man's-land between Saudi Arabia and Iraq that was divided<br>> more or less equally between the two in the early 1990s.<br>> (There's more to the story, but that's the<br>> idea.) It would not have made sense for programs or humans
<br>> to assume that old "Neutral Zone" tagged content should be<br>> interpreted either as Saudi Arabia or as Iraq.<br>><br>> The same danger would exist by mapping "CS" to "RS";
<br>> important distinctions related to Montenegrin usage might be<br>> inappropriately assumed to be Serbian.<br>><br>> I agree that ISO 3166 gives no guidance here. UN M.49 did<br>> assign two new codes to replace the one code for Serbia and
<br>> Montenegro, but that is not really "guidance" about usage<br>> going forward.<br>><br>> Another list member wrote:<br>><br>> > Plus comment of See RS for Serbia or ME for Montenegro?<br>
><br>> I actually like this idea, and everyone knows how<br>> conservative I am about the Comments field. There will<br>> probably be people years from now who still think Serbia and<br>> Montenegro are one country (just like the one I talked to six
<br>> months ago who thought Czechoslovakia still existed), and<br>> this sort of comment would help them make the right call.<br>><br>> On the contrary...<br>><br>> > So, multiple Preferred-Value fields?
<br>><br>> No, no. That would be crossing the streams. Preferred-Value<br>> tells the program or human, "Instead of tag or subtag A, you<br>> should use B instead." It wouldn't make sense to say, "...
<br>> use B or C instead, it's up to you."<br>><br>> The opposite situation might make sense some day, though: two<br>> or more deprecated subtags with the same Preferred-Value.<br>> "Instead of A or B, use C instead."
<br>><br>> Remember that Preferred-Value doesn't imply that existing<br>> content should be retagged.<br>><br>> If anyone else has an opinion on Preferred-Value or Comments<br>> fields for region CS, or anything related to it, please send
<br>> them to the list where all 120-odd list members can see them<br>> and respond.<br>><br>> --<br>> Doug Ewell * Fullerton, California, USA * RFC 4645 *<br>> UTN #14 <a href="http://users.adelphia.net/~dewell/">
http://users.adelphia.net/~dewell/</a><br>> <a href="http://www1.ietf.org/html.charters/ltru-charter.html">http://www1.ietf.org/html.charters/ltru-charter.html</a><br>> <a href="http://www.alvestrand.no/mailman/listinfo/ietf-languages">
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