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<div class=Section1>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span style='font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'>Just because 3066bis is not published with
an RFC number yet doesn’t mean that it isn’t BCP 47, does it? That
isn’t how the process was presented to me. I’ve been told
repeatedly that once the RFC-to-be has passed through the process to IESG
approval, we’re done. (And the appearance of the new registry is evidence
of this.) If you need a subtag, submit a 3066bis request and let’s testdrive
the system…<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span style='font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'><o:p> </o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><st1:place w:st="on"><font size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span
style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'>Addison</span></font></st1:place><font
size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial;
color:navy'><o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<div>
<p><font size=2 color=navy face="Times New Roman"><span style='font-size:10.0pt;
color:navy'>Addison Phillips<br>
Internationalization Architect - Yahoo! Inc.<br>
<br>
Internationalization is an architecture.<br>
It is not a feature. </span></font><o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
<div style='border:none;border-left:solid blue 1.5pt;padding:0in 0in 0in 4.0pt'>
<div>
<div class=MsoNormal align=center style='text-align:center'><font size=3
face="Times New Roman"><span style='font-size:12.0pt'>
<hr size=2 width="100%" align=center tabindex=-1>
</span></font></div>
<p class=MsoNormal><b><font size=2 face=Tahoma><span style='font-size:10.0pt;
font-family:Tahoma;font-weight:bold'>From:</span></font></b><font size=2
face=Tahoma><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Tahoma'> ltru-bounces@ietf.org
[mailto:ltru-bounces@ietf.org] <b><span style='font-weight:bold'>On Behalf Of </span></b>Misha
Wolf<br>
<b><span style='font-weight:bold'>Sent:</span></b> Friday, February 10, 2006
11:05 AM<br>
<b><span style='font-weight:bold'>To:</span></b> newsml-2@yahoogroups.com<br>
<b><span style='font-weight:bold'>Cc:</span></b> ltru@ietf.org;
ietf-languages@alvestrand.no<br>
<b><span style='font-weight:bold'>Subject:</span></b> [Ltru] RE: [newsml-2]
japanese scripts (was: person/name given and family elements)</span></font><o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=3 face="Times New Roman"><span style='font-size:
12.0pt'><o:p> </o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=blue face=Verdana><span style='font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Verdana;color:blue'>Unfortunately, this page:</span></font><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=blue face=Verdana><span style='font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Verdana;color:blue'> <a
href="http://www.iana.org/numbers.html#L">http://www.iana.org/numbers.html#L</a></span></font><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=blue face=Verdana><span style='font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Verdana;color:blue'>says:</span></font><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=3 face="Times New Roman"><span style='font-size:
12.0pt'> </span></font><font size=2 color=blue face=Verdana><span
style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Verdana;color:blue'>"No further
registrations in this registry."</span></font><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=blue face=Verdana><span style='font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Verdana;color:blue'>in relation to the RFC 3066 language
tags registry.</span></font><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=3 face="Times New Roman"><span style='font-size:
12.0pt'> <o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=blue face=Verdana><span style='font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Verdana;color:blue'>I suppose that if the IETF takes much
longer to move RFC 3066 bis to RFC status, we may have to lobby for the RFC
3066 registry to be re-opened. We're now stuck between one system which
has closed and another which has not yet opened.</span></font><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=3 face="Times New Roman"><span style='font-size:
12.0pt'> <o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=blue face=Verdana><span style='font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Verdana;color:blue'>Misha</span></font><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=3 face="Times New Roman"><span style='font-size:
12.0pt'> <o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=3 face="Times New Roman"><span style='font-size:
12.0pt'><o:p> </o:p></span></font></p>
<div class=MsoNormal align=center style='text-align:center'><font size=3
face="Times New Roman"><span style='font-size:12.0pt'>
<hr size=2 width="100%" align=center tabIndex=-1>
</span></font></div>
<p class=MsoNormal style='margin-bottom:12.0pt'><b><font size=2 face=Tahoma><span
style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Tahoma;font-weight:bold'>From:</span></font></b><font
size=2 face=Tahoma><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Tahoma'>
newsml-2@yahoogroups.com [mailto:newsml-2@yahoogroups.com] <b><span
style='font-weight:bold'>On Behalf Of </span></b>Rob Warner<br>
<b><span style='font-weight:bold'>Sent:</span></b> 10 February 2006 18:53<br>
<b><span style='font-weight:bold'>To:</span></b> newsml-2@yahoogroups.com<br>
<b><span style='font-weight:bold'>Subject:</span></b> Re: [newsml-2] japanese
scripts (was: person/name given and family elements)</span></font><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=MsoNormal style='margin-bottom:12.0pt'><font size=3
face="Times New Roman"><span style='font-size:12.0pt'>It's worth noting that
the XML 1.0 specification does explicitly allow for values in a form defined by
RFC 3066's successor to be used in xml:lang attributes: <a
href="http://www.w3.org/TR/2004/REC-xml-20040204/#sec-lang-tag">http://www.w3.org/TR/2004/REC-xml-20040204/#sec-lang-tag</a><br>
<br>
The danger of course is that existing consumers may not fully understand the
new syntax. Since there are really no NewsML 2 consumers yet, that's
probably not an issue for us. <br>
<br>
If RFC 3066 bis is too far in the future, we might look at registering jp-Hani
& friends, the same way zh-Hans & zh-Hant were done.<br>
<br>
cheers,<br>
<br>
Rob<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<div>
<p class=MsoNormal><span class=gmailquote><font size=3 face="Times New Roman"><span
style='font-size:12.0pt'>On 10/02/06, <b><span style='font-weight:bold'>Misha
Wolf</span></b> <<a href="mailto:misha.wolf@reuters.com">misha.wolf@reuters.com</a>>
wrote:</span></font></span> <o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=blue face=Verdana><span style='font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Verdana;color:blue'>Yes. I imagine that the new RFC
will be approved before NewsML 2 is finalised.</span></font><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=3 face="Times New Roman"><span style='font-size:
12.0pt'> <o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=blue face=Verdana><span style='font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Verdana;color:blue'>Misha</span></font><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=3 face="Times New Roman"><span style='font-size:
12.0pt'><o:p> </o:p></span></font></p>
<div class=MsoNormal align=center style='text-align:center'><font size=3
face="Times New Roman"><span style='font-size:12.0pt'>
<hr size=2 width="100%" align=center>
</span></font></div>
<p class=MsoNormal><span class=q><b><font size=2 face=Tahoma><span
style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Tahoma;font-weight:bold'>From:</span></font></b></span><span
class=q><font size=2 face=Tahoma><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:
Tahoma'> <a href="mailto:newsml-2@yahoogroups.com" target="_blank">newsml-2@yahoogroups.com</a>
[mailto:<a href="mailto:newsml-2@yahoogroups.com" target="_blank">newsml-2@yahoogroups.com</a>]
<b><span style='font-weight:bold'>On Behalf Of </span></b>Laurent Le Meur</span></font></span><font
size=2 face=Tahoma><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Tahoma'><br>
<b><span style='font-weight:bold'>Sent:</span></b> 10 February 2006 17:37<br>
<span class=q><b><span style='font-weight:bold'>To:</span></b> <a
href="mailto:newsml-2@yahoogroups.com" target="_blank">newsml-2@yahoogroups.com</a></span><br>
<b><span style='font-weight:bold'>Cc:</span></b> <a href="mailto:ltru@ietf.org"
target="_blank">ltru@ietf.org</a></span></font> <o:p></o:p></p>
<div><span id="q_109552d41eacd92a_5">
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 face=Tahoma><span style='font-size:10.0pt;
font-family:Tahoma'><br>
<span class=e><b><span style='font-weight:bold'>Subject:</span></b> RE: [newsml-2]
japanese scripts (was: person/name given and family elements)</span><br>
<br>
</span></font><o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
</span>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=3 face="Times New Roman"><span style='font-size:
12.0pt'><o:p> </o:p></span></font></p>
<div><span id="q_109552d41eacd92a_7">
<div>
<p><font size=3 color=black face=Arial><span lang=EN-GB style='font-size:12.0pt;
font-family:Arial;color:black'>Therefore your proposal is to explicitly and
provisionally allow for xml:lang="jp-Hani", isn't it? </span></font><o:p></o:p></p>
<p><font size=3 face="Times New Roman"><span style='font-size:12.0pt'> <o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p><font size=3 color=black face=Arial><span lang=EN-GB style='font-size:12.0pt;
font-family:Arial;color:black'>Laurent</span></font><font size=2 color=navy
face=Arial><span lang=EN-GB style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial;
color:navy'> </span></font><o:p></o:p></p>
<p><font size=3 face="Times New Roman"><span style='font-size:12.0pt'> <o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<div style='border:none;border-left:solid windowtext 1.5pt;padding:0in 0in 0in 4.0pt'>
<div>
<div class=MsoNormal align=center style='text-align:center'><font size=3
face="Times New Roman"><span style='font-size:12.0pt'>
<hr size=2 width="100%" align=center>
</span></font></div>
<p><b><font size=2 face=Tahoma><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Tahoma;
font-weight:bold'>De :</span></font></b><font size=2 face=Tahoma><span
style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Tahoma'> <a
href="mailto:newsml-2@yahoogroups.com" target="_blank">newsml-2@yahoogroups.com</a>
[mailto:<a href="mailto:newsml-2@yahoogroups.com" target="_blank">
newsml-2@yahoogroups.com</a>] <b><span style='font-weight:bold'>De la part de</span></b>
Misha Wolf<br>
<b><span style='font-weight:bold'>Envoyé :</span></b> vendredi 10 février
2006 18:21<br>
<b><span style='font-weight:bold'>À :</span></b> <a
href="mailto:newsml-2@yahoogroups.com" target="_blank">newsml-2@yahoogroups.com</a><br>
<b><span style='font-weight:bold'>Cc :</span></b> <a
href="mailto:ltru@ietf.org" target="_blank">ltru@ietf.org</a><br>
<b><span style='font-weight:bold'>Objet :</span></b> RE: [newsml-2]
japanese scripts (was: person/name given and family elements)</span></font><o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
<p><font size=3 face="Times New Roman"><span style='font-size:12.0pt'> <o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p><font size=2 color=blue face=Verdana><span style='font-size:10.0pt;
font-family:Verdana;color:blue'>It would be a bad idea to introduce a
"script" attribute now, just before draft-ietf-ltru-registry [1]
becomes an RFC, replacing RFC 3066.</span></font><o:p></o:p></p>
<p><font size=3 face="Times New Roman"><span style='font-size:12.0pt'> <o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p><font size=2 color=blue face=Verdana><span style='font-size:10.0pt;
font-family:Verdana;color:blue'>[1] <a
href="http://ietfreport.isoc.org/idref/draft-ietf-ltru-registry/"
target="_blank">http://ietfreport.isoc.org/idref/draft-ietf-ltru-registry/</a> </span></font><o:p></o:p></p>
<p><font size=3 face="Times New Roman"><span style='font-size:12.0pt'> <o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p><font size=2 color=blue face=Verdana><span style='font-size:10.0pt;
font-family:Verdana;color:blue'>Misha</span></font><o:p></o:p></p>
<p><font size=3 face="Times New Roman"><span style='font-size:12.0pt'> <o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p><font size=3 face="Times New Roman"><span style='font-size:12.0pt'> <o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<div class=MsoNormal align=center style='text-align:center'><font size=3
face="Times New Roman"><span style='font-size:12.0pt'>
<hr size=2 width="100%" align=center>
</span></font></div>
<p style='margin-bottom:12.0pt'><b><font size=2 face=Tahoma><span
style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Tahoma;font-weight:bold'>From:</span></font></b><font
size=2 face=Tahoma><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Tahoma'> <a
href="mailto:newsml-2@yahoogroups.com" target="_blank">newsml-2@yahoogroups.com</a>
[mailto:<a href="mailto:newsml-2@yahoogroups.com" target="_blank">newsml-2@yahoogroups.com</a>]
<b><span style='font-weight:bold'>On Behalf Of </span></b>Laurent Le Meur<br>
<b><span style='font-weight:bold'>Sent:</span></b> 10 February 2006 11:33<br>
<b><span style='font-weight:bold'>To:</span></b> <a
href="mailto:newsml-2@yahoogroups.com" target="_blank">newsml-2@yahoogroups.com</a><br>
<b><span style='font-weight:bold'>Subject:</span></b> RE: [newsml-2] japanese
scripts (was: person/name given and family elements)</span></font><o:p></o:p></p>
<p><font size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:
Arial;color:navy'>Takahiro, </span></font><o:p></o:p></p>
<p><font size=3 face="Times New Roman"><span style='font-size:12.0pt'> <o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p><font size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span lang=EN-GB style='font-size:10.0pt;
font-family:Arial;color:navy'>The xml:lang attribute can take values indicating
a script: it is the case for </span></font><font size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span
lang=EN style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'>zh-Hans and
zh-Hant (Traditional vs. Simplified Chinese), isn't it?</span></font><o:p></o:p></p>
<p><font size=3 face="Times New Roman"><span style='font-size:12.0pt'> <o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p><font size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span lang=EN-GB style='font-size:10.0pt;
font-family:Arial;color:navy'>I see that it is not currently used for Japanese
scripts (kanji, katagana, hiragana).</span></font><o:p></o:p></p>
<p><font size=3 face="Times New Roman"><span style='font-size:12.0pt'> <o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p><font size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span lang=EN-GB style='font-size:10.0pt;
font-family:Arial;color:navy'>I spotted:</span></font><o:p></o:p></p>
<p><font size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span lang=EN-GB style='font-size:10.0pt;
font-family:Arial;color:navy'><a
href="http://www.w3.org/International/articles/language-tags/" target="_blank">http://www.w3.org/International/articles/language-tags/</a>
</span></font><o:p></o:p></p>
<p><font size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span lang=EN-GB style='font-size:10.0pt;
font-family:Arial;color:navy'>"</span></font><font size=2 color="#333333"
face=Arial><span lang=EN style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:#333333'>
There is a need, sometimes, to distinguish the script used, in addition to the
language. For example, Mongolian might be written in Mongolian script or
Cyrillic; Croatian might be written in Latin or Cyrillic; ..."</span></font><o:p></o:p></p>
<p><font size=3 face="Times New Roman"><span style='font-size:12.0pt'> <o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p><font size=2 color="#333333" face=Arial><span lang=EN style='font-size:11.0pt;
font-family:Arial;color:#333333'>Then <a
href="http://www.inter-locale.com/ID/draft-ietf-ltru-registry-13.html#script"
target="_blank">http://www.inter-locale.com/ID/draft-ietf-ltru-registry-13.html#script</a>
</span></font><o:p></o:p></p>
<p><font size=2 color="#333333" face=Arial><span lang=EN style='font-size:11.0pt;
font-family:Arial;color:#333333'>"Script subtags are used to indicate the
script or writing system variations that distinguish the written forms of a
language or its dialects. The following rules apply to the script subtags:
"</span></font><o:p></o:p></p>
<p><font size=3 face="Times New Roman"><span style='font-size:12.0pt'> <o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p><font size=2 color="#333333" face=Arial><span lang=EN style='font-size:11.0pt;
font-family:Arial;color:#333333'>Then <a
href="http://www.unicode.org/iso15924/iso15924-codes.html" target="_blank">http://www.unicode.org/iso15924/iso15924-codes.html</a>
</span></font><o:p></o:p></p>
<p><font size=2 color="#333333" face=Arial><span lang=EN-GB style='font-size:
11.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:#333333'>And found the tokens found in HR-ML
samples </span></font><o:p></o:p></p>
<p><font size=2 color="#333333" face=Arial><span lang=SV style='font-size:11.0pt;
font-family:Arial;color:#333333'>- Hani (for Kanji)</span></font><o:p></o:p></p>
<p><font size=3 color=black face=Arial><span lang=SV style='font-size:12.0pt;
font-family:Arial;color:black'>- Kana (Katakana)</span></font><o:p></o:p></p>
<p><font size=3 color=black face=Arial><span lang=SV style='font-size:12.0pt;
font-family:Arial;color:black'>- Hrkt (alias for Hiragana + Katakana)</span></font><o:p></o:p></p>
<p><font size=3 face="Times New Roman"><span style='font-size:12.0pt'> <o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p><font size=3 color=black face=Arial><span lang=EN-GB style='font-size:12.0pt;
font-family:Arial;color:black'>My question: Can't we already express script
with xml:lang="jp-Hani" ?</span></font><o:p></o:p></p>
<p><font size=3 color=black face=Arial><span lang=EN-GB style='font-size:12.0pt;
font-family:Arial;color:black'>(I imagine that it would not be RFC3066
compliant any more).</span></font><o:p></o:p></p>
<p><font size=3 face="Times New Roman"><span style='font-size:12.0pt'> <o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p><font size=3 color=black face=Arial><span lang=EN-GB style='font-size:12.0pt;
font-family:Arial;color:black'>If not, should we then create a specific
attribute, as a sibling of xml:lang, in all elements supporting strings, that
will be deprecated when the replacement of RFC3066 is standardized? If so, why
are we the only group looking at this problem?</span></font><o:p></o:p></p>
<p><font size=3 face="Times New Roman"><span style='font-size:12.0pt'> <o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p><font size=3 color=black face=Arial><span lang=EN-GB style='font-size:12.0pt;
font-family:Arial;color:black'>Laurent</span></font><font size=2 color="#333333"
face=Arial><span lang=EN-GB style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:Arial;
color:#333333'> </span></font><o:p></o:p></p>
<p><font size=3 face="Times New Roman"><span style='font-size:12.0pt'> <o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p><font size=3 face="Times New Roman"><span style='font-size:12.0pt'> <o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
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<p><b><font size=2 face=Tahoma><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Tahoma;
font-weight:bold'>De :</span></font></b><font size=2 face=Tahoma><span
style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Tahoma'> <a
href="mailto:newsml-2@yahoogroups.com" target="_blank">newsml-2@yahoogroups.com</a>
[mailto:<a href="mailto:newsml-2@yahoogroups.com" target="_blank"> newsml-2@yahoogroups.com</a>]
<b><span style='font-weight:bold'>De la part de</span></b> Takahiro FUJIWARA<br>
<b><span style='font-weight:bold'>Envoyé :</span></b> lundi 16 janvier
2006 01:20<br>
<b><span style='font-weight:bold'>À :</span></b> <a
href="mailto:newsml-2@yahoogroups.com" target="_blank">newsml-2@yahoogroups.com</a><br>
<b><span style='font-weight:bold'>Objet :</span></b> Re: [newsml-2] FW:
person/name given and family elements</span></font><o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
<p><font size=3 face="Times New Roman"><span style='font-size:12.0pt'> <o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<div>
<p><font size=2 face=Arial><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial'>I
would explain from the view of Japanese people.</span></font><o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
<div>
<p><font size=3 face="Times New Roman"><span style='font-size:12.0pt'> <o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
</div>
<div>
<p><font size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span lang=EN-GB style='font-size:10.0pt;
font-family:Arial;color:navy'>> With Japanese comes another factor: two
scripts for one language.</span></font><o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
<div>
<p><font size=2 color=black face=Arial><span lang=EN-GB style='font-size:10.0pt;
font-family:Arial;color:black'>Yes! this is the thing what I want to say.</span></font><o:p></o:p></p>
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<p><font size=2 color=black face=Arial><span lang=EN-GB style='font-size:10.0pt;
font-family:Arial;color:black'> We always need two scripts in the
application form such as resident registration, curriculum vitae(résumé),
application form when the online shopping...</span></font><o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
<div>
<p><font size=2 color=black face=Arial><span lang=EN-GB style='font-size:10.0pt;
font-family:Arial;color:black'> One is for the formal printable
name. The other one is for the pronunciation. There is many
ways to write a pronunciation such as Hiragana, Katakana,
multiple-romanisations. But there is needed only one
pronunciation in one application form because we can convert to another.
This pronunciation is also used for the name list with order by
pronunciation. Japanese people do not use order by Alphabetical nor order
by Kanji.</span></font><o:p></o:p></p>
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<p><font size=3 face="Times New Roman"><span style='font-size:12.0pt'> <o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
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<div>
<p><font size=2 color=black face=Arial><span lang=EN-GB style='font-size:10.0pt;
font-family:Arial;color:black'>Takahiro Fujiwara</span></font><o:p></o:p></p>
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