<div class="gmail_quote">As requested by Patrik Fälström, I copy these questions to the WG list.<br>Portzamparc<br><br>-----<br><blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="border-left: 1px solid rgb(204, 204, 204); margin: 0pt 0pt 0pt 0.8ex; padding-left: 1ex;">
> At 23:15 08/02/2010, Patrik Fältström wrote:<br>
>> Part from standing behind what Vint wrote in his response, let me answer more directly the questions from Lisa.<br>
>><br>
>> I am a developer/designer of mostly web based software for management of domain names, web sites, email services and what not. I will (and want to be able to) in my interfaces first of all be pretty sure over what data comes to me as a "server". I.e. I want to know what the end user really wanted to give me (I did explicitly not say "typed" here for reasons I hope people understand).<br>
><br>
> I understand that you are on the server end. You are related to a user and you do not know if this is a direct relation, or it goes through a bowser, an iPhone, a Client, a User Agent. Correct? Yet, you also consider the case where you may have to develop the User Client/Agent and you control things down to the user's fingers?<br>
><br>
>> Now, if the web browser (if the web browser was used) did some trick and converted some characters, then I do not get the characters the end user typed (for example), but regardless of this, I will do whatever I want to do to make the end user happy. Exactly what that implies will differ depending on context. Is this domain name management or management of a web site, or the management of email addresses or sites?<br>
><br>
> So you mean that the reference is what the user wants to achieve? And your understanding of what he wants to achieve will depend on different context inputs, and obviously of the protocol being used and the task to be performed? Also from the zone?<br>
><br>
>> Is this mapping, if applied, to be implemented in the browser or in the web server? I would like to get as raw data as possible, without having the browser doing anything, so that I know as much as possible on the server side. So I can "help" users the same way browsers today "help" users by adding ".COM" TLD if that is not added. "guessing" I think it can be called.<br>
><br>
> I understand this is in the case where you have to develop the user client interface?<br>
><br>
>> And if HTTP/Web browser is not in use, but instead for example an iPhone application that then interact over JSON/Netstring/TCP with some server API, then I can in a more direct way control what is sent to the server (if I also write the client). I will only be confused (possibly) over the mapping that is in the operating system / user interface libraries.<br>
><br>
> OK. Did you think of a method for you to clarify that possible confusion?<br>
><br>
>> All of this might sounds like if it will make things messier for the user, but in reality I do not think so. *NO* developer have the interest in making this messier for the user. And exactly what it means to make it easier for the user depends on context. Very much. Specifically when we have so many protocols and environments and contexts where domain names are in use.<br>
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> As I said, I am not that much competent in Web level applications, rather with user level interapplications. Which documentation do you use to identify how you should understand what to do with a given protocol, in a given environment, for a given context?<br>
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>> Saying just "no mapping at registration time" is not good enough for me. What about if you want to change the holder or adminc or techc of a domain? Should you do mapping then, if the domain name is typed by the user or not? Is a transfer of a domain name "registration time"?<br>
><br>
> Good point. What if the Registry sotfware does not consider holder/adminc/techc and uses a different system? What is the Registry only use local script/language interfaces?<br>
><br>
>> No, I rather see that I as a developer can do whatever I want to make things easier for the users, and that might include that I try to do some mappings of codepoints that are not PVALID, or complete changes of some things that might be domain names (hard to know sometimes) to something that are domain names (different separators between labels for example).<br>
><br>
> and French/Latin language majuscule support?<br>
><br>
>> So to answer your question Lisa: No, it is not clear what characters are suggested to be mapped, but we do not even know where or who has the responsibility to do the mapping -- if any. In the case of HTTP, is that done in the web browser or on the server side, in the cgi?<br>
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> I have some difficulty here: how can an IDN be mapped on the server side? Should it not necessarily be mapped on the user side so it can be properly resolved to that very server?<br>
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>> For example how do a web browser know whether the ajax / json call is to be "a registration" or not? A situation when mapping should explicitly not occur? It can not, and because of that browsers should not include any mapping at all. Ever.<br>
>> That is one view, and of course you can find the arguments the other way around as well.<br>
><br>
> I agree with your position. Would you know of an online document/discussion on this matter, or a con/pro list?<br>
><br>
>> And this is why I think the current mapping document is as good as we can get it -- and why I think (like Pete) TR46 is too strong. Because it is very wrong to explicitly ask for mappings the way it does.<br>
><br>
> Do you know if other possibilities have been expressed by W3C, or SDOs?<br>
><br>
>> What *might* be ok and good to do is to say what codepoints can be mapped in various contexts to other characters, but I think for example the definition of bundles in the IANA registries to some degree do that. When not mapping from PVALID to other PVALID of course. So that people know that IF one work in a specific context (certain language for example), THEN it MIGHT be interesting to map from A to B.<br>
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> Do you consider the possibility of mapping on a TLD basis?<br>
><br>
>> So I would say the mapping document we have is good.<br>
><br>
> How would you qualify it? a reminder, a protection against too stringent or lax behaviours, a guidance, a reference, a open link to further work?<br>
> Is its informational nature not a problem while it completes a standard track work?<br>
><br>
> Thank you.<br>
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